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imiweli
07-24-2010, 03:09 AM
Who's the NFL's most overrated player

My pick is Ronnie Brown - people talk about him as one of the best running backs in the league. Mike Lombardi said he would be a 'blue chip' player if not for the injuries.

Best what has he done in the league, except destroy the Patriots in one game and be outplayed by a 24 year old Ricky Williams?

MattBer2c
07-24-2010, 04:37 AM
My vote goes to Kevin Kolb. He's no scrub, but I have heard way too much about this guy for his very short NFL resume.

stranman
07-24-2010, 07:08 AM
It has to be T.O. He's just an average to good receiver who gets way too much press. It's been that way for several years now.

Tinindian
07-24-2010, 07:23 AM
Who's the NFL's most overrated player

My pick is Ronnie Brown - people talk about him as one of the best running backs in the league. Mike Lombardi said he would be a 'blue chip' player if not for the injuries.

Best what has he done in the league, except destroy the Patriots in one game and be outplayed by a 24 year old Ricky Williams?

And he is still better than any back on the Pats!

Pattrick
07-24-2010, 07:52 AM
be outplayed by a 24 year old Ricky Williams?

Maybe you meant 34 year old Ricky Williams?

My vote for most overrated player goes to Ray Lewis.

Gandalf2300
07-24-2010, 08:14 AM
T. O. is probably the most overhyped athlete in the NFL, compared to his mediocre performance on the field. He is in great physical condition but lacks speed at this point, and always has a lot of drops. He is more overhyped than Ochocinco, and at least Ochocinco can play decent football. Though T. O. seems to have toned down his diva act in Buffalo last year, his declining performance on the field makes him less likely to land somewhere. That being said, one team in the NFL may be desperate enough at WR to take a flier on Owens.

buzmeg
07-24-2010, 09:52 AM
Michael Vick: before and after his off field activities.
He never was or ever will be a top notch QB.

Bengals1181
07-24-2010, 10:09 AM
It has to be T.O. He's just an average to good receiver who gets way too much press. It's been that way for several years now.

I agree he gets too much press, but I don't know if you can call a guy who's probably going to end up in the hall of fame overrated.

Bengals1181
07-24-2010, 10:11 AM
I'll say it:


Phillip Rivers


I could toss jump balls all day to 3 6'5" WR's too.

Tinindian
07-24-2010, 10:13 AM
Michael Vick: before and after his off field activities.
He never was or ever will be a top notch QB.

Agreed. Michael Vick has never shown me anything but athletic ablity. I have never seen great QB skills or the leadership you expect from someone that is supposed to be so great.

Bunghole
07-24-2010, 10:16 AM
It has to be T.O. He's just an average to good receiver who gets way too much press. It's been that way for several years now.


T. O. is probably the most overhyped athlete in the NFL, compared to his mediocre performance on the field. He is in great physical condition but lacks speed at this point, and always has a lot of drops. He is more overhyped than Ochocinco, and at least Ochocinco can play decent football. Though T. O. seems to have toned down his diva act in Buffalo last year, his declining performance on the field makes him less likely to land somewhere. That being said, one team in the NFL may be desperate enough at WR to take a flier on Owens.

Pardon the expression, but you guys are nuts. TO is a first ballot HOFer if one goes only by his stats. Nine of his thirteen NFL seasons he's had over 1,000 yds receiving. NINE. He has averaged 11 TD's per year for thirteen freaking years! Think about that a moment. Too many people are saying he's washed up based on his stats from last season, which is bogus to say because he was playing for the Bills, and they were a bad football team last season. Not to mention that Ryan Fitzpatrick was his QB, whom is just not an NFL caliber starter. Check what Chad Ochocinco's stats were in 2008 when Fitzpatrick was the starter in Cincinnati...they were equally dreadful.

I don't like TO or his personality, but stats are stats. The guy's been a monster throughout his entire career. He's not what he once was, and he's a locker room black hole, but he's still better than most team's #2 WR from a sheer talent perspective.



Michael Vick: before and after his off field activities.
He never was or ever will be a top notch QB.

This is a pretty good vote. The guy was/is a RB disguised as a QB.

bluestree
07-24-2010, 11:22 AM
Hines Ward. He's tough, and he will catch the ball, but he has benefited from a quarterback who can hold the ball till he can get open. He gets a lot of catches on the scramble drill. He plays home games on turf that is ridiculously slow, which works with his physical style of play. In a scheme that relied more on short timing patterns, his lack of elite speed would make him average. He's also a cheap shot artist that hit's guys away from the ball.

ncoolong
07-24-2010, 11:44 AM
Hines Ward. He's tough, and he will catch the ball, but he has benefited from a quarterback who can hold the ball till he can get open
He had three consecutive 1,000 yard seasons with 26 touchdowns when Kordell Stewart and Tommy Maddox were throwing to him. Kordell never threw well on the move, and Maddox had the mobility of the Art Rooney statue outside Heinz Field.


He plays home games on turf that is ridiculously slow, which works with his physical style of play.
49 catches on the road, 46 at home last year.


In a scheme that relied more on short timing patterns, his lack of elite speed would make him average.
I'm not seeing your point. His production is fact. You are making a generalization that you can't support in any way. I suppose the fact he plays in the slot (thus, running plenty of timing routes) doesn't mean anything, either.


He's also a cheap shot artist that hit's guys away from the ball.
lol So he's overrated?? You may not like him, and that's fine, but he's not overrated.

ncoolong
07-24-2010, 11:59 AM
I'm not sure if I can put Mark Sanchez on here, but no one has a wider gap between the hype he gets and the level of success he's had.

DannyMilk
07-24-2010, 01:35 PM
As far as Vick, I don't even consider him a player anymore to be honest. My vote's for Carson Palmer (sorry guys haha)

illmatc2
07-24-2010, 01:57 PM
It sounds a little crazy but I think Reggie Wayne might get a vote....Manning has proven he can make Wide Outs look great (Garcon and Collie, Gonzalez before that) and think about if you put the other top notch wide outs with Manning don't you think they would be better. It might be a lil crazy but that also means it might be a little true. Put Hines Ward on the Colts Manning would love his toughness and get him 115 catches a year no doubt...

illmatc2
07-24-2010, 02:01 PM
and alot of people have T.O. on here as overated, could you imagine if T.O. had Manning throwing to him...

KabaModernFan
07-24-2010, 02:45 PM
I'm not sure if I can put Mark Sanchez on here, but no one has a wider gap between the hype he gets and the level of success he's had.

I agree with...the Steelers fan? Isn't this a sign of the apocalypse? Yes though, the Mark Sanchez hype machine is something that I can't stand. Any starting QB in the NFL last year could've led that Jets team to the Playoffs.

bluestree
07-24-2010, 03:36 PM
He had three consecutive 1,000 yard seasons with 26 touchdowns when Kordell Stewart and Tommy Maddox were throwing to him. Kordell never threw well on the move, and Maddox had the mobility of the Art Rooney statue outside Heinz Field.


49 catches on the road, 46 at home last year.


I'm not seeing your point. His production is fact. You are making a generalization that you can't support in any way. I suppose the fact he plays in the slot (thus, running plenty of timing routes) doesn't mean anything, either.


lol So he's overrated?? You may not like him, and that's fine, but he's not overrated.

Can't believe it took over 20 minutes for a Steeler fan to comment!

cobber66
07-24-2010, 04:37 PM
My vote for most overrated player goes to Ray Lewis.

I happen to agree. That's not to say he still isn't a very good player, but let's face it, he's not year 2000 Ray Lewis, or even 2006 Ray Lewis anymore. But, his emotional leadership/smack talk/self-hype/whatever you want to call it draws a lot of praise from the media, to the point where I would say it's a huge part of his 'aura' of greatness, not only to fans, but maybe even to other teams and players as well.

bluestree
07-24-2010, 04:53 PM
One of, if not the most overated linebackers IMO; Sean Merriman. The average fan probably thinks of him getting 'blowed up' by MJD, but whenever you see the Chargers, he's featured when they break down the defense.

Colts01
07-24-2010, 05:53 PM
Michael Vick: before and after his off field activities.
He never was or ever will be a top notch QB.
agree on Vick

Bengals1181
07-24-2010, 08:39 PM
As far as Vick, I don't even consider him a player anymore to be honest. My vote's for Carson Palmer (sorry guys haha)


overrated by who? Everyone you ask seems to think he's washed up.



Another one I'll add, not just because you're a Bears fan, is Cutler.

TheLinc
07-25-2010, 12:11 AM
Vick, Rashard Mendenhall, Kellen Winslow, Jason Peters.

DannyMilk
07-25-2010, 12:22 AM
overrated by who? Everyone you ask seems to think he's washed up.



Another one I'll add, not just because you're a Bears fan, is Cutler.


Only thing I'll say about that is I think Palmer's reached his ceiling, but Cutler hasn't. I agree that he's overrated, but we don't know much about QBs in these parts haha. People get p-o'd on these boards about Palmer a lot more often than I think they should be, hence why I think he's overrated.

TheLinc
07-25-2010, 12:29 AM
Only thing I'll say about that is I think Palmer's reached his ceiling, but Cutler hasn't. I agree that he's overrated, but we don't know much about QBs in these parts haha. People get p-o'd on these boards about Palmer a lot more often than I think they should be, hence why I think he's overrated.

Easy to get defensive about a franchise player who has shown flashes of greatness but gets hampered by injuries and poor team play. I think Palmer is right where he belongs with most rankings, hovering above the middle.

Docta
07-25-2010, 12:32 AM
Vick, Rashard Mendenhall, Kellen Winslow, Jason Peters.
Disagree with Winslow. He'd be one of the top 3 TE's in the game if he was just durable.

DannyMilk
07-25-2010, 12:32 AM
Easy to get defensive about a franchise player who has shown flashes of greatness but gets hampered by injuries and poor team play.

I didn't know this was a Grant Hill thread...........*and, rim shot*

TheLinc
07-25-2010, 01:11 AM
Disagree with Winslow. He'd be one of the top 3 TE's in the game if he was just durable.

Perhaps, and I do think he's got the physical tools to perform at a high level despite being stuck on bad teams. I just don't view him as the threat a lot of fantasy owners and analysts still consider him to be.

MattBer2c
07-25-2010, 01:34 AM
Pardon the expression, but you guys are nuts. TO is a first ballot HOFer if one goes only by his stats.It's tough to say he's a first ballot guy when Cris Carter(and Collinsworth!) haven't made it in yet.

But I agree, TO has been awesome in his career.

KabaModernFan
07-25-2010, 02:08 AM
It's tough to say he's a first ballot guy when Cris Carter(and Collinsworth!) haven't made it in yet.

But I agree, TO has been awesome in his career.

T.O. is ahead of Carter in both receiving yards and TDs, and is poised to pass him in receptions as well. I'd say Owens is a first ballot guy, but Carter should've been too.

TheLinc
07-25-2010, 02:12 AM
T.O. is ahead of Carter in both receiving yards and TDs, and is poised to pass him in receptions as well. I'd say Owens is a first ballot guy, but Carter should've been too.

Agreed on both points, though admittedly I didn't started following the NFL closely until the decline of Carter's career, so I can't comment if he commanded the same fear that T.O. once did. Then again, how much of those intangibles are given serious weight in the debate? They are both legendary wide receivers, to be sure.

Colts01
07-25-2010, 02:36 AM
As far as Vick, I don't even consider him a player anymore to be honest. My vote's for Carson Palmer (sorry guys haha)

playA maybe?

TheLinc
07-25-2010, 04:18 AM
As far as Vick, I don't even consider him a player anymore to be honest.

Cling tightly to those thoughts when he and Jackson steamroll Chicago this Fall ;)

MattBer2c
07-25-2010, 05:14 AM
T.O. is ahead of Carter in both receiving yards and TDs, and is poised to pass him in receptions as well. I'd say Owens is a first ballot guy, but Carter should've been too.
I suspected he would be ahead in stats. During one of TO's games last year they showed TD's, receptions, and yards of TO, Rice, and Moss(Carter wasn't even mentioned). I just always get beaten over the head with how difficult it is for WR's to get into the HOF.

I really wouldn't be able to put it into perspective as well as some of you. I'm only 22...I mean, I was only 9 when Brett won SB 31! Most players I really remember watching are still on their way to being eligible for the HOF.

ncoolong
07-25-2010, 06:11 AM
I agree with...the Steelers fan? Isn't this a sign of the apocalypse? Yes though, the Mark Sanchez hype machine is something that I can't stand. Any starting QB in the NFL last year could've led that Jets team to the Playoffs.

Ha! Love it!

And remember, even an ardent Jets fan knows they didn't play their last two games against the same level of competition as most of the rest of the league did. They made the most of what they were given, and they can't be blamed for the Colts' decision to lay down or the Bengals not having anything to play for. As it is, they still grabbed the last Wild Card spot.

stranman
07-25-2010, 07:03 AM
In an era when alot of receivers have impressive numbers, TO is not a lock for the Hall.

TheLinc
07-25-2010, 09:11 AM
In an era when alot of receivers have impressive numbers, TO is not a lock for the Hall.

Oh stop - the guy kept defensive coordinators up at night when he was in his prime. Owens, Moss and Harrison are the definition of locks when it comes to generational receivers. It's only a question of when. And if someone were to drop a cinder block on his head during his acceptance speech, I would not object.

Bunghole
07-25-2010, 09:14 AM
In an era when alot of receivers have impressive numbers, TO is not a lock for the Hall.

Yes he is, because no current player's numbers come close, and TO is second or third to players named Rice, Harrison or Carter. In the entire history of the NFL! And he's still playing (well, allegedly).

Tinindian
07-25-2010, 09:43 AM
TO is a HOFer. There is no way he is not. I am no fan of his but to say otherwise is silly. Cris Carter is HOFer too and it is beyond me why he hasn't gotten in yet. You are talking about two of the most prolific, dangerous and game changing WO's to ever play the game. Cris Carter was a train wreck as an individual early on but he finally grew up. He made some of the greatest catches I ever saw. Remember "all he does is catch touchdowns".

Chompurself
07-25-2010, 09:49 AM
Most over-rated player of all-time in Emmitt Smith, I'm not saying he wasn't a good player but he definitely in overated I wouldn't even put him in the top-5 talk. Considering all of the players he had surrounding him for nearly his whole career his job was made extremely easy by the o-line WRs etc

kotar44
07-25-2010, 10:25 AM
Has to be Ray Lewis...remember when he disappeared for a few seasons and everyone thought he was done, only to rebound and become a media darling again? Oddly enough his resurgence coincided with the development of their D-line. He is the definition of a system player...oh, and also the witness to a murder that he helped cover up, but thats another story I guess.

BisonTribe
07-25-2010, 10:44 AM
Emmitt Smith's incredible durability and ability to perform when everybody knew what play was being called invalidates the assertion that he's the most overrated player of all time. Seriously, there wasn't a whole lot of mystery to Dallas' playcalling, and considering how fast RBs careers fall off, you can't say the man is the MOST overrated. Just look at guys like Tomlinson, Terrell Davis, Jamal Lewis, etc who were all highly productive but nowhere near as long as Smith. Also, performing in the playoffs as he did has to count for something.

As for my opinion of the most overrated player, I'm going to have to go with Refrigerator Perry. Sure he made massive DTs famous and helped usher in "the planet theory", but has anybody lived off a reputation as long as that guy did? A gimmicky TD in a rout of a Super Bowl that should've belonged to Sweetness.

SEABAGS
07-25-2010, 12:32 PM
Maybe you meant 34 year old Ricky Williams?

My vote for most overrated player goes to Ray Lewis.

couldn't agree more

DannyMilk
07-25-2010, 01:06 PM
playA maybe?

I'd pay 4 million dollars for an NFL Halloween Party, where Vick and Goodell are dressed in the tuxs from Dumb and Dumber...how's THAT for Playa?


Cling tightly to those thoughts when he and Jackson steamroll Chicago this Fall ;)

I'm not going to lie, I am actually NOT scared of the Eagles this year, so the final score should only be 38-17 or something....I really hate your city (Not only from ur team destroying us, but I had a terrible time there a few years ago and will never go back haha)

cobber66
07-25-2010, 01:14 PM
Has to be Ray Lewis...He is the definition of a system player...oh, and also the witness to a murder that he helped cover up, but thats another story I guess.

Wasn't there even talk that he actually committed that crime (again, ALLEGEDLY)? I want to hear Ravens fans to defend Ray Lewis and the rest of the Baltimore defense. Their d-line is very solid, but are they going to be able to cover people this year? And now Ed Reed is possibly going to start the year on the PUP list (I'm sure it has NOTHING to do with his unhappiness with his contract situation).

Colts01
07-25-2010, 01:16 PM
I'd pay 4 million dollars for an NFL Halloween Party, where Vick and Goodell are dressed in the tuxs from Dumb and Dumber...how's THAT for Playa?

Now thats my kind of party,priceless!

bluestree
07-25-2010, 02:15 PM
Most over-rated player of all-time in Emmitt Smith, I'm not saying he wasn't a good player but he definitely in overated I wouldn't even put him in the top-5 talk. Considering all of the players he had surrounding him for nearly his whole career his job was made extremely easy by the o-line WRs etc

I always felt that way, he ran through holes a mile wide during the 'Boys glory years. But sometimes when enough people tell you your nuts you start to think maybe they're right. My good buddy is a Steeler fan and he feels strongly that Hines Ward is a HOF'er, and I just don't see it. I think the team and the system made him. I asked my brother in law, who lives in Cleveland and hates the Steelers, and he says definitely, he's a HOF'er. I guess overated is hard to quantify. I just don't see Emmitt as a HOF'er, but obviously, all these football guru's and ex-players and such would disagree.

illmatc2
07-25-2010, 05:06 PM
Most over-rated player of all-time in Emmitt Smith, I'm not saying he wasn't a good player but he definitely in overated I wouldn't even put him in the top-5 talk. Considering all of the players he had surrounding him for nearly his whole career his job was made extremely easy by the o-line WRs etc
AGREED!! if he didn't get four yards before he even got touched his stats would be completely different. Might not even be top ten of all time.

giantsfan97
07-25-2010, 05:13 PM
I just don't see Emmitt as a HOF'er, but obviously, all these football guru's and ex-players and such would disagree.
I agree he is probably somewhat overrated for reasons that have already been stated. But you can't really argue that he's not a HOF'er can you? I mean, his statistics (even if partially earned because of his teammates) have to count enough to get him in.

KabaModernFan
07-25-2010, 05:19 PM
Wasn't there even talk that he actually committed that crime (again, ALLEGEDLY)? I want to hear Ravens fans to defend Ray Lewis and the rest of the Baltimore defense. Their d-line is very solid, but are they going to be able to cover people this year? And now Ed Reed is possibly going to start the year on the PUP list (I'm sure it has NOTHING to do with his unhappiness with his contract situation).

It's funny how everyone seemed to broadcast and publish the news that Ed Reed was going to start the season on the PUP List, but nobody wants to backtrack now that Ed Reed himself has said that he NEVER said that, or was at least misinterpreted. At his football camp on Wednesday he said that he plans to play Week One against the Jets, and that he's not sure where all this talk about him starting on the PUP List came from.

nate2588
07-25-2010, 05:53 PM
Marvin Harrison. That Colts offense has not dropped off at all since he retired.

bluestree
07-25-2010, 08:47 PM
I agree he is probably somewhat overrated for reasons that have already been stated. But you can't really argue that he's not a HOF'er can you? I mean, his statistics (even if partially earned because of his teammates) have to count enough to get him in.

Being the all time rusher gets you in, it has to. Funny though how the #3 all time wideout isn't a first ballot. The game continues to change. When you start to talk about who should or shouldn't be in the Hall, I'm conflicted. Today the game is dominated by the Super Bowl. "He's got a ring." you'll here it when they discuss candidates. I just wonder what our perception of Emmitt would be if Buffalo had won one and Pittsburgh had, too. Either way he'd have a crap load of stats. When you go to the Hall it feels like it's more about the individual men, and the game, less about the teams. I guess you could say a guy contributed to championship teams, and that factors in. I don't know. I'll be in Canton this week, and always have to go to the Hall. Wish I was there next week for the game etc!

Turk Schonert
07-25-2010, 09:09 PM
If pay means anything, its got to be Charlie Whitehurst. What has he done (other then be a #3 QB) to warrant a 5 million dollar a year salary ?

Bunghole
07-25-2010, 09:28 PM
Marvin Harrison. That Colts offense has not dropped off at all since he retired.

Yeah, but he had such a prolific career that it s hard to say he's overrated just because they have Manning and continue to reload with good wideouts. The balls still have to be caught and even Peyton doesn't place them perfectly every time. And Marvin caught a lot of them over the years.

BubbaLove
07-25-2010, 09:29 PM
I skimmed through the 6 pages here, so it's possible I missed it, but I'm surprised I haven't seen Eli Manning mentioned. Yah, I know he was part of a Super Bowl winning team, but one hot streak doesn't make up for a career of inconsistency that is Eli. He also makes an amazing amount of money for what he delivers.

jaGmen
07-25-2010, 09:32 PM
Tom Brady. He won 3 super bowls with a coach that cheated and was nothing more than a game manager without Randy Moss and Wes Welker

jaGmen
07-25-2010, 09:36 PM
I also give honorable mention to Adrian Peterson. He gets hurt too much and wouldn't be anything without another guy in the backfield and fumbles every other carry

TheLinc
07-25-2010, 09:37 PM
Tom Brady. He won 3 super bowls with a coach that cheated and was nothing more than a game manager without Randy Moss and Wes Welker

Quite an axe you have there, might take you a while to grind it...

giantsfan97
07-25-2010, 10:27 PM
I skimmed through the 6 pages here, so it's possible I missed it, but I'm surprised I haven't seen Eli Manning mentioned. Yah, I know he was part of a Super Bowl winning team, but one hot streak doesn't make up for a career of inconsistency that is Eli. He also makes an amazing amount of money for what he delivers.
Allow me to defend Eli (that's my quarterback! *sniff*) - I don't think you can call him overrated because I don't think anybody really rates him that high. I usually see him ranked somewhere in the 2nd tier of QBs (Peyton, Brady, Brees being tier 1) and I would say he deserves to be there. He has been inconsistent but makes big plays when it matters and has improved every season. He does a great job with his pre-snap reads and has helped groomed a trio of young receivers into a pretty good group. Bottom line, he will rarely lose a game for you... and while he rarely dominates a game, has been a big part of the Giants winning record since he became the starter.


Tom Brady. He won 3 super bowls with a coach that cheated and was nothing more than a game manager without Randy Moss and Wes Welker
I hate Tom Brady as much as any true blooded Ahmerrrican but the guy has skill and was winning well before Moss and Welker.

Colts01
07-25-2010, 10:37 PM
Allow me to defend Eli (that's my quarterback! *sniff*) - I don't think you can call him overrated because I don't think anybody really rates him that high. I usually see him ranked somewhere in the 2nd tier of QBs (Peyton, Brady, Brees being tier 1) and I would say he deserves to be there. He has been inconsistent but makes big plays when it matters and has improved every season. He does a great job with his pre-snap reads and has helped groomed a trio of young receivers into a pretty good group. Bottom line, he will rarely lose a game for you... and while he rarely dominates a game, has been a big part of the Giants winning record since he became the starter.


I hate Tom Brady as much as any true blooded Ahmerrrican but the guy has skill and was winning well before Moss and Welker.

hahaha good calls on both,Eli is 2nd tier but dont think overrated

Colts01
07-25-2010, 10:38 PM
If pay means anything, its got to be Charlie Whitehurst. What has he done (other then be a #3 QB) to warrant a 5 million dollar a year salary ?

sounds to me like hes got a great agent as well! I think we will finally get to find out this year sometime though

DannyMilk
07-26-2010, 12:35 AM
If pay means anything, its got to be Charlie Whitehurst. What has he done (other then be a #3 QB) to warrant a 5 million dollar a year salary ?

the fact that his first name isn't Matt, and his last name isn't Hasselbeck is worth 3 Mil alone, no?

Pattrick
07-26-2010, 04:06 AM
the fact that his first name isn't Matt, and his last name isn't Hasselbeck is worth 3 Mil alone, no?



Has anyone figured out Pete's reasoning for trading for Mr. Whitehurst and paying him all that money yet? Or are we all still in the dark? With my luck, watch him be name the starter against my niners and tear them apart.....

BayouBoys
07-26-2010, 04:09 AM
I don't like this thread based on the fact that people are saying ray lewis because he is starting to slip since he is getting older. I want to focus on people that are more in their prime. Like say, Sanchez? Possibly? What about Roy williams? Brandon Jacobs? Big ben at times annoys me. What about Miles austin, if he slips this year people will be reminded why he slipped through the cracks all these years. (I am not saying he will slip this year, but it would NOT surprise me) Maybe they aren't in their primes really but I'm talking about overrated due to the fact that they are being hyped up at the current moment.

I just don't want to say "overrated" about players that are nearing retirement. Not all people have crazy blood in them a la Favre. And this talk about TO being overrated is hysterical. When did you start watching the nfl? 3 years ago!

ps...this is the first time I've actually been somewhat disappointed in comments.

Chompurself
07-26-2010, 04:11 AM
How about Mark Sanchez

Am I the only one who thinks that he's just "a guy" he's not quite Trent Dilfer yet but maybe with a lil hard work he can get there

BayouBoys
07-26-2010, 04:54 AM
How about Mark Sanchez

Am I the only one who thinks that he's just "a guy" he's not quite Trent Dilfer yet but maybe with a lil hard work he can get there

Haha. I literally just used this type of reference on another thread. It's the one about stafford or sanchez and someone said they'd rather stafford at QB then sanchez cause he'll be just a guy. But I'd rather have just a "guy" since thats what dilfer did. And I think sanchez has already surpassed dilfer in all aspects except one big one...that big ring.

Chompurself
07-26-2010, 05:28 AM
Haha. I literally just used this type of reference on another thread. It's the one about stafford or sanchez and someone said they'd rather stafford at QB then sanchez cause he'll be just a guy. But I'd rather have just a "guy" since thats what dilfer did. And I think sanchez has already surpassed dilfer in all aspects except one big one...that big ring.

That's bcus its me again lol

BayouBoys
07-26-2010, 05:43 AM
Well well well...WE MEET AGAIN! haha. Both him and dilfer were asked to manage games. It's funny, this is such a weird conversation considering it is about trent dilfer being a great QB. ha! Sanchez will end up better if he isn't already. Like I said, he either needs that ring or a couple more seasons then he is better. That ravens D was just too scary.

Tinindian
07-26-2010, 06:09 AM
Don't bang on Emmitt too hard. Is he the best RB ever? Not even close. He had a great offensive line but every great back, with the notable exception of Barry Sanders, has. I remember that game where Emmitt had a seperated shoulder early in the game and still ran for 170+ yards and caught balls for another 60+. Awesome performance. Overrated? Only when people equate the rushing title with being the best ever. One of the all-time greats? Without question.

PhinsJunkie
07-26-2010, 08:06 AM
Who's the NFL's most overrated player

My pick is Ronnie Brown - people talk about him as one of the best running backs in the league. Mike Lombardi said he would be a 'blue chip' player if not for the injuries.

Best what has he done in the league, except destroy the Patriots in one game and be outplayed by a 24 year old Ricky Williams?

Why would you consider him the most overrated? What rating has been placed on him? Nobody has ever compared him to the best of all time. His numbers and injury record are what they are. But when he's on the feild, he produces. That can't be argued.

PhinsJunkie
07-26-2010, 08:09 AM
It has to be T.O. He's just an average to good receiver who gets way too much press. It's been that way for several years now.

He's a first ballot hall of famer and will go down in history as one of the best WR of all time. Yes, I agree, he's a diva and loves attention. But so does Brett Favre. Until last year, his numbers had been average for at least 5 years.

PhinsJunkie
07-26-2010, 08:12 AM
Michael Vick: before and after his off field activities.
He never was or ever will be a top notch QB.

Agree 100%

TheLinc
07-26-2010, 08:16 AM
Why would you consider him the most overrated? What rating has been placed on him? Nobody has ever compared him to the best of all time. His numbers and injury record are what they are. But when he's on the feild, he produces. That can't be argued.

No shame in sharing the spotlight with Williams either. That guy can still smoke the competition.

PhinsJunkie
07-26-2010, 08:28 AM
No shame in sharing the spotlight with Williams either. That guy can still smoke the competition.

"smoke the competition." haha, I love it!

Polishguy00
07-26-2010, 08:45 AM
Depends how we want to define overrated. If it is based on how much we hear the name compared to recent on-field accomplishment, I probably have to go with Shawne Merriman. I think young guys like Sanchez and Stafford should get a pass here. Those guys are still playing catch-up with the speed of the NFL. Give guys who have one year or less a pass. I have to admit that the career numbers of my boy Cutler and how much he is talked about puts him the running even though I love the guy on Sundees.

If we want to talk overrated in terms of pay compared to on-field accomplishments then that would include every single top ten pick in recent history who does not at least start for their team or starts and has crappy stats on a team that can't put anyone else in the lineup due to their commitment to said sucky guy. Think Glenn Dorsey here. Two years and two sacks. Chuck Whitehurst and Roy Williams are in this group.

Despite my T.O. bashing and my Ray Lewis bashing that has been done for me (thank fellow members), I think they get passes because, well, they're old. NFL old, anyway. They are expected to be not as good. It is more the fault of all of us that talk about these guys and remember the "Good Old Days."

So. My worst two offenders are Shawne Merriman and Roy Williams.

tacotime
07-26-2010, 09:11 AM
It has to be T.O. He's just an average to good receiver who gets way too much press. It's been that way for several years now.
The question was overated, not who was disliked. I didn't like it when he came to my Cowboys. However, he was productive. I feel that he is still a top 20 receiver. If he wasn't, why would the Rams take a chance on T.O.'s type of cancer to the rookie QB Bradford?

kotar44
07-26-2010, 10:46 AM
Bayou, I think you are confusing overrated and over hyped. Sanchez is not overrated, but he is definitely being hyped too the extreme. Ray Lewis et al are talked about as HOF'ers, and in my opinion that constitutes over rating players. And as for Roy Williams, I think everyone agrees he is garbage, so neither label apply.

bluestree
07-26-2010, 04:08 PM
Bayou, I think you are confusing overrated and over hyped. Sanchez is not overrated, but he is definitely being hyped too the extreme. Ray Lewis et al are talked about as HOF'ers, and in my opinion that constitutes over rating players. And as for Roy Williams, I think everyone agrees he is garbage, so neither label apply.

You can see reading the posts that it's hard to define overated vs. over hyped vs. over paid vs. over and done. Let's change the topic to; Overexposed. My vote, Visanthe Shiancoe.

Pruitt
07-26-2010, 04:09 PM
Most over-rated player of all-time in Emmitt Smith, I'm not saying he wasn't a good player but he definitely in overated I wouldn't even put him in the top-5 talk. Considering all of the players he had surrounding him for nearly his whole career his job was made extremely easy by the o-line WRs etc

WHUCK?! That's crazy talk.

Most overrated player - Steve Slaton (at least on fantasy draft day last year. I took him 6th overall)

In reality: Eli Manning

giantsfan97
07-26-2010, 04:15 PM
In reality: Eli Manning
http://footballproslive.com/showthread.php/595-Most-Overrated-Player?p=9769#post9769

BubbaLove
07-26-2010, 08:53 PM
Allow me to defend Eli (that's my quarterback! *sniff*) - I don't think you can call him overrated because I don't think anybody really rates him that high. I usually see him ranked somewhere in the 2nd tier of QBs (Peyton, Brady, Brees being tier 1) and I would say he deserves to be there. He has been inconsistent but makes big plays when it matters and has improved every season. He does a great job with his pre-snap reads and has helped groomed a trio of young receivers into a pretty good group. Bottom line, he will rarely lose a game for you... and while he rarely dominates a game, has been a big part of the Giants winning record since he became the starter.

I don't know that he's not overrated, but if as a Giants fan you don't believe he is but in your own words call him second tier (I say at the bottom of that second tier), then I'll just say that he's way overpaid.

bluestree
07-26-2010, 11:37 PM
You can see reading the posts that it's hard to define overated vs. over hyped vs. over paid vs. over and done. Let's change the topic to; Overexposed. My vote, Visanthe Shiancoe.
Once again I'm having a problem keeping up with breaking news. Beating out Shiancoe for most overexposed player in a photo finish................Martellus Bennet.

Memo to self; refrain from sending nude cell phone picture to woman who might post on internet (if she doesn't die laughing).

KiranR
07-26-2010, 11:41 PM
Brett Favre. Period.

BubbaLove
07-26-2010, 11:50 PM
Brett Favre. Period.

Not a fan of Favre in the least, but I'm curious about how many QB's you would rate above him?

kotar44
07-27-2010, 01:08 AM
Eli? He's not even in the top 2 overrated QB's in his division...yea, that's right, I'm talking to you Romo and McNabb. Romo is still discussed as an elite QB, although he hasn't really done much, and we all know McNabb is just one of those guys-good enough to win, not good enough to ever win it all. Eli's not even as overrated as his trade partner, Philip Rivers...he throws like a girl!

TheLinc
07-27-2010, 02:25 AM
Brett Favre. Period.

Poor form, show your work. I mean, the man is comfortable in Wrangler - that's got to count for something.

ElShay
07-27-2010, 06:19 AM
Jay Cutler. I can always count on him turning the ball over in a critical situation. He could be Rex Grossman 2.0 (improved arm strength).

jaGmen
07-27-2010, 09:49 PM
I hate Tom Brady as much as any true blooded Ahmerrrican but the guy has skill and was winning well before Moss and Welker.[/QUOTE]

I never said he didn't have skill. Was he winning? Yes. Did he have a cheating coach and defense? Yes. It annoys me to no end that people think of him as the best QB in the league and possibly one of the best ever when he wouldn't have squat without Belidick and his sony squad. Bill sucked in Cleveland. So what he just drank some magic potion and became a good coach? No, he knew exactly what play the opposition was running the whole time. I could have won super bowls with that information. Nobody should have anything they did while on those teams be considered when voting for the hall of fame. That is likely the one and only thing the NCAA has on the NFL, they punish those who cheat.

Bunghole
07-27-2010, 10:11 PM
Brady is an elite QB. Sometimes even if you cheat it doesn't help you. If an offensive play is executed to perfection, just because the defense knows its coming doesn't mean they can stop it. The counter trey comes to mind with the Hogs and The Diesel (Riggins). Every o-coordinator worth his salt is constant;y coming up with plays to defeat cheating defenses (and by cheating, I mean "creeping up").

KiranR
07-27-2010, 10:40 PM
Not a fan of Favre in the least, but I'm curious about how many QB's you would rate above him?

Here's my list of quarterbacks rated purely on passing ability that rank ahead of Favre. This is the ALL TIME list. If you want details, read the following post by Andy - http://footballproslive.com/showthread.php/656-Proof-of-major-flaw-in-QB-rating

1. Joe Montana
2. Steve Young
3. Ken Anderson
4. Sammy Baugh
5. Fran Tarkenton
6. Len Dawson
7. Peyton Manning
8. Bart Starr
9. YA Tittle
10. Troy Aikman
11. Johnny Unitas
12. Otto Graham
13. Roger Staubach
14. Kurt Warner
15. Sonny Jurgensen
16. Brett Favre

Note that all of the QBs that I have ranked ahead of Favre are in the HOF except for Manning (who most undoubtedly will be), Warner (who, in my opinion is right on the fence), and Ken Anderson. Ken Anderson has got to be the ALL-TIME most under-rated and under-appreciated player, EVER.

We tend to live in the current and remember the recent. History provides a refreshing perspective.

thephaze
07-28-2010, 01:34 AM
Over-rated? Peyton Manning.

He chokes in big games and in the post season.

See also, Eli Manning.

Colts01
07-28-2010, 01:37 AM
Over-rated? Peyton Manning.

He chokes in big games and in the post season.

See also, Eli Manning.
how many super bowl rings do you have?

BubbaLove
07-28-2010, 01:52 AM
Here's my list of quarterbacks rated purely on passing ability that rank ahead of Favre. This is the ALL TIME list. If you want details, read the following post by Andy - http://footballproslive.com/showthread.php/656-Proof-of-major-flaw-in-QB-rating

1. Joe Montana
2. Steve Young
3. Ken Anderson
4. Sammy Baugh
5. Fran Tarkenton
6. Len Dawson
7. Peyton Manning
8. Bart Starr
9. YA Tittle
10. Troy Aikman
11. Johnny Unitas
12. Otto Graham
13. Roger Staubach
14. Kurt Warner
15. Sonny Jurgensen
16. Brett Favre

Note that all of the QBs that I have ranked ahead of Favre are in the HOF except for Manning (who most undoubtedly will be), Warner (who, in my opinion is right on the fence), and Ken Anderson. Ken Anderson has got to be the ALL-TIME most under-rated and under-appreciated player, EVER.

We tend to live in the current and remember the recent. History provides a refreshing perspective.

Unless I misunderstood, I thought we were talking about current players, but whatever.

I think Ken Anderson is a little high at #3, but I do agree that he should defintely be in the HOF along with fellow Bengal CB Ken Riley.

Then again, I am a Bengals fan, but maybe the guys that played with them might want to chime in...And you know who you are...

Pruitt
07-28-2010, 09:51 AM
Here's my list of quarterbacks rated purely on passing ability that rank ahead of Favre. This is the ALL TIME list. If you want details, read the following post by Andy - http://footballproslive.com/showthread.php/656-Proof-of-major-flaw-in-QB-rating

3. Ken Anderson
6. Len Dawson
15. Sonny Jurgensen

We tend to live in the current and remember the recent. History provides a refreshing perspective.

Ummm... history can also be nonsense - which it is in this case. I am also not a massive Favre fan, but give the guy his due, there's not a single fan who saw these three play that would put them ahead of Favre.

Except Bengals fans.

Ken Anderson was a good quarterback, but I think you're confusing stats with greatness.

mjchefer
07-28-2010, 10:10 AM
I'm voting T.O. Poor Bengals.

giantsfan97
07-28-2010, 12:43 PM
I'll stop posting about Eli in this thread after this (I've already made my point), but I still don't see where Eli is being so highly rated as to be overrated. Unless you think he is actually a bad QB.

GBPKS
07-28-2010, 01:03 PM
T. O. is probably the most overhyped athlete in the NFL, compared to his mediocre performance on the field. He is in great physical condition but lacks speed at this point, and always has a lot of drops. He is more overhyped than Ochocinco, and at least Ochocinco can play decent football. Though T. O. seems to have toned down his diva act in Buffalo last year, his declining performance on the field makes him less likely to land somewhere. That being said, one team in the NFL may be desperate enough at WR to take a flier on Owens.

TO in his prime was one of the greatest WR specimens of all-time - absolutely dominant in all phases of the game. Now, obviously age has set in, and his attitude problems are legendary, but in terms of on the field I wouldn't call TO overrated.

I don't think anyone expects the TO of today to be the TO of yesteryear.

GBPKS
07-28-2010, 01:22 PM
Brett Favre. Period.

Stunned that it took 9 pages of posts for the first person to name Favre.

Favre is a real interesting case career-wise because obviously he owns every statistic, both good and bad, in the record book.

I don't think Favre cracks the list of the super elite greatest quarterbacks of all-time but he definitely is the next notch down and a first ballot Hall of Famer.

The knocks on him are that he only has one championship and in the second half of his career has had the propensity for the backbreaking season-ending interception (the 4th & 26 game, the 2007 NFC Championship Game, last year's NFC Championship Game). The one ring thing is a little unfortunate because his prime intersected with the end of the Aikman Cowboy dynasty (Dallas knocked the Pack out of the playoffs three straight times) and the John Elway/Terrell Davis back-to-back Broncos.

Favre will go down in history as the toughest QB of all-time and one of the, if not the most entertaining quarterback to watch of all-time. Certainly, his diva act the last few years has rubbed people the wrong way and his ugly exit from Green Bay has tarnished him in the eyes of some of the Packer faithful, but when it's all said and done, Favre may not deserve every single accolade he's given by the media, but he's certainly earned his fair share.

MiamiMitch
07-28-2010, 01:34 PM
Who's the NFL's most overrated player

My pick is Ronnie Brown - people talk about him as one of the best running backs in the league. Mike Lombardi said he would be a 'blue chip' player if not for the injuries.

Best what has he done in the league, except destroy the Patriots in one game and be outplayed by a 24 year old Ricky Williams?


I may be biased here, but no way is Ronnie Brown overrated. He is an bsolute beast. His only issue is injuries. During the 1-15 season, before his season ending injury, he was well on his way to being the best fantasy back in the game.

puppychili
07-28-2010, 02:08 PM
Favre without a doubt. It's a shame that it took him leaving Green Bay for most Packer fans to see that.

nolaguy
07-28-2010, 02:22 PM
Easy choice - Tony Romo. I remember after his first start the NFL network had a 2 hour special called "Who is Tony Romo?". He has done nothing of any significance in his career. No way he ever wins a 'Bowl.

BayouBoys
07-29-2010, 03:39 PM
Easy choice - Tony Romo. I remember after his first start the NFL network had a 2 hour special called "Who is Tony Romo?". He has done nothing of any significance in his career. No way he ever wins a 'Bowl.

Ah you have to love "america's team" but that goes back to the overhyped. But what I really want to know is, how is Ray Lewis overrated? Am I missing something here? I mean I thought that was a 100% agreed upon thing around the players that the guy is an animal.

rxbrown86
07-29-2010, 09:26 PM
I hate to say it but it's... Casey Hampton

bluestree
07-29-2010, 10:45 PM
Favre is a real interesting case career-wise because obviously he owns every statistic, both good and bad, in the record book.

Has anyone ever seen an analysis of Favre's records compared by percentage with the other greats? He has had so many more opportunities, played in so many more games. Is there a record of attempted passes?

TheRealJosh
07-30-2010, 07:23 AM
I didn't have time to quote everyone on T.O. HOFer, but here's the rebuttal. Cris Carter probably thought he was a first, 2nd, or 3rd ballot HOFer. I think the voters will be waiting out on all WRs, because they've always taken a long-term view of the enshrinement. Steve Largent and Jerry Rice are the only 2 WRs I can recall getting in on the first ballot. I'm 26.

Bengals1181
07-30-2010, 09:15 AM
I didn't have time to quote everyone on T.O. HOFer, but here's the rebuttal. Cris Carter probably thought he was a first, 2nd, or 3rd ballot HOFer. I think the voters will be waiting out on all WRs, because they've always taken a long-term view of the enshrinement. Steve Largent and Jerry Rice are the only 2 WRs I can recall getting in on the first ballot. I'm 26.



I don't think he's a first ballot HOF, but most (if not all) of TO's stats are better than Carter's.

Pruitt
07-30-2010, 09:23 AM
I think the Terrell Owens first-ballot H.O.F. talk was started by some radio guy in order to stir up controversy among his listeners.

The guy has had a really good career, but first ballot? When guys like Andre Reed and Henry Ellard and Cris Carter aren't even in the Hall... Please. There are 21 WRs in the hall of fame. Maybe Owens will one day be in there, but I sincerely doubt it.

bluestree
07-30-2010, 10:04 AM
I think the Terrell Owens first-ballot H.O.F. talk was started by some radio guy in order to stir up controversy among his listeners.

The guy has had a really good career, but first ballot? When guys like Andre Reed and Henry Ellard and Cris Carter aren't even in the Hall... Please. There are 21 WRs in the hall of fame. Maybe Owens will one day be in there, but I sincerely doubt it.

Recent wide receiver candidates stats are downgraded because of the explosion of offense in the last 15 or so years. Also there's the Art Monk effect. You've got a logjam of deserving players building up that will hurt TO. I don't think he will be in the Hall for many, many years.

Bengals1181
07-30-2010, 10:23 AM
I think the Terrell Owens first-ballot H.O.F. talk was started by some radio guy in order to stir up controversy among his listeners.

The guy has had a really good career, but first ballot? When guys like Andre Reed and Henry Ellard and Cris Carter aren't even in the Hall... Please. There are 21 WRs in the hall of fame. Maybe Owens will one day be in there, but I sincerely doubt it.



he's top 3 ALL TIME in touchdowns and yards (will move to 2nd this year). FOURTH all time in receptions, with a chance to finish top 3.


TO is a hall of famer.

RogerH
07-30-2010, 02:04 PM
I haven't made it all the way through every page yet, but has someone mentioned Anquan Boldin? Sure, he may be one of the toughest guys in the NFL, but to me he never produces up to they hype (or maybe fantasy football has skewed by opinion). Of course he played oppositte Fitzgerald so he may shine brighter in Baltimore, but Flacco isn't as good as Warner (may change in the future, but that's how it is right now), and they'll run a lot more than Arizona did.

ppdoc
07-30-2010, 02:47 PM
Q caught 100 balls before Fitz got there. He has the highest per yar catch average in the NFL over the last 5 years. He has caught over 70 balls every year he has been in the league (i think.) How can he be overrated?

TheRealJosh
07-30-2010, 10:41 PM
he's top 3 ALL TIME in touchdowns and yards (will move to 2nd this year). FOURTH all time in receptions, with a chance to finish top 3.


TO is a hall of famer.

And the game has been greatly modified to make everything easier on the offense, no axing, an enforced 5 yrd cushion, no cracking defenseless receivers. I'd vote for him, but I don't think recent Hall votes show that he's got a good shot.

TheRealJosh
07-30-2010, 10:42 PM
I disagree with the BOldin overrated, he had his face broken, removed, and came back in 3 weeks. He is one of the few rookies to pass 1ooo yrd in his rookie season. I believe he had 260 his first NFL game.

Colts01
07-30-2010, 10:46 PM
I disagree with the BOldin overrated, he had his face broken, removed, and came back in 3 weeks. He is one of the few rookies to pass 1ooo yrd in his rookie season. I believe he had 260 his first NFL game.

Yea any man who has his face broken and returns for more in less then a month,gotta respect him.

BubbaLove
07-31-2010, 12:11 AM
And the game has been greatly modified to make everything easier on the offense, no axing, an enforced 5 yrd cushion, no cracking defenseless receivers. I'd vote for him, but I don't think recent Hall votes show that he's got a good shot.


By the "five yard cushion" I assume you mean "Illegal Use of Hands" or "defensive holding" after 5 yards from the line of scrimage? That was changed way back in 1978 and it's probably the most important rule change ever as far as the recieving game goes. I know the NFL has continued to tweak the rules to favor the more exciting passing game, but by the time that guys like Cris (our wonderful host), Phil McConkey and Jerry Rice came around the NFL passing game had drastically changed from just a few years before.

That said, I think it would be unfair to Owens to not include him as a potential first ballot Hall of Famer. It will remain to be seen whether or not he has burned too many bridges, but he is worthy of the honor based on production.

SixxShooter
07-31-2010, 09:50 AM
Correct. I've been an eyewitness of Vick's career. Million dollar body, ten cent head. Not a leader, not a winner, not a professional.

Pruitt
07-31-2010, 10:43 AM
Sam Bradford?

Tinindian
07-31-2010, 11:19 AM
Sam Bradford?

In light of the contract he just got, I'd have to say yes on Bradford.

Pruitt
07-31-2010, 11:26 AM
he's top 3 ALL TIME in touchdowns and yards (will move to 2nd this year). FOURTH all time in receptions, with a chance to finish top 3.


TO is a hall of famer.

We'll talk in 2020.

BayouBoys
08-02-2010, 01:03 AM
In light of the contract he just got, I'd have to say yes on Bradford.

Let him play some. calm down!

Pruitt
08-02-2010, 11:55 PM
I'm going to nominate Hines Ward just because I'm sick of hearing that he's under rated.