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  • Worth the Trouble?



    When a person Googles "Darrelle Revis Unhappy with Contract," they will find plenty of results. A little less than a million, actually. It seems that Revis is simply a player that may never be happy with his deal. Because of this and because of the money Revis costs already, the Jets are considering their options. I will spit out a few stats here about his dominance, but there is no doubt that the cornerback out of Pittsburgh is a rare commodity. The words "shutdown corner" are not thrown around in a loose manner. Revis is one of the few out there. Is he worth 1/7th of a team's salary cap?

    Darrelle Revis became a dominant corner quickly. By his second season, teams were already shying away from his side of the field. Most attempts were futile. In 2009, Pro Football Outsiders ranked him as the top corner in the league. In 2010 and 2011, though, he was still pretty good according to their metrics, but he did allow almost three more yards per play in his direction. The advantage he gave is that reputation kept him dominant because teams simply did not throw his way very often. Teams went his way about twice a game in 2010. They got more daring in 2011 and threw at him about four times a game. It's hard to gain yards on a guy if he is never tested.

    Unfortunately, dominance is not the big question surrounding Darrelle Revis. There are several other major points to consider. First and foremost is the money and how it relates to Revis' consternation. His unhappiness seemed to begin in June of 2010 when Manish Mehta reported that Revis may hold out then. Also, I just have to interject something here. I have never met Mr. Mehta, but I imagine his personal life to be a model of placidity. I would want to rid my life of all drama if I had to cover the Jets. Anyway, Revis had now played this same game with his contract in each of the last three seasons despite eventually getting paid in 2010 with a deal that awarded him $30 Million over the first two years of the contract. It seems that the cornerback wants something nearing the money that Peyton Manning and Drew Brees earn. Is there any way that it is possible that he could be worth that?

    Well, let's say a modern elite quarterback produces a dozen more touchdowns than the average quarterback in the league. How many does Revis prevent? He does give up a couple each season, but with the way the ball is spread around by offenses, it would be tough to say that he prevents that many. Maybe he prevents six or eight per season. That's highly valuable, but not as valuable as an elite quarterback.

    Also, the league is trending toward even more implementation of spread offenses and 3+ receiver sets. What does that do to his value since he is best at being a physical man-to-man corner? Can he make the adjustments in his game to continue to take away an entire side of the field? Revis has been considered to be an average run defender in his career. Are teams better off getting two or three above-average corners than getting Revis? Certainly, there has to be some offensive coordinators that will be perfectly happy playing ten on ten football when their quarterback is also a running threat.

    Finally, what about that whole knee injury thing? Research by the sabermetrics crowd in football and other sports implies that the real peak of an athlete's performance is somewhere between the ages of 25 and 27. When camp starts, Revis will be 28 and coming off that injury.

    The timing of Revis' recovery constricts the options the Jets have with him. They can save some money by cutting him, but that costs the value of a good asset. Even that has to be considered, though, with the Jets sitting somewhere around $19 million above the cap. Despite the questions above, there will be teams lining up to get the star player. The best thing for the Jets would probably be to trade him near draft time, but medical questions may prevent that possibility. Revis cannot be franchised, a part of his 2010 contract, so it is likely that the trade would happen as soon as he is healthy. In 2013 or 2014, Darrelle Revis will be getting a lot of money to play for a team because that is how things happen in the free agency era. Just let these words serve as the warning they are.

    Comments 28 Comments
    1. ScottDCP's Avatar
      Using Aaron Williams and Justin Rogers of 2012 projected over a full season each, the worst CB in the league will give up 12-16 touchdowns directly, and (I am guessing here) another half dozen by failure to make a drive-stopping play on third and long. Using that number (that I just made up while changing a diaper) the best CB has less impact re: the average (terminology iwatt?) than does the best QB, as the average CB gives up more than zero TDs per year.

      Worth the noise because of skill (only reporters and fans get truly bothered by contract squabbles so long as dude performs when he shows up) but not worth quite the money he seeks.
    1. iwatt's Avatar
      Imagine the circus if they let revis go...

      By the Way, the Jets ranked 10th in DVOA in pass defense, ion a season they mostly played without Revis. He isn't going to be paid QB money. Not with the salary cap.

      Basically, a Qb touches the ball concervatively on 70% of his teams offensive snaps, either by passing or handing off (say the team passes 60% of the time, and 10% is runs were he fakes a pass or audibles to a run, and he isn't simply handing off). Revis is facing 4 plays out of 60. He does close half the field, making life easier on the rest of the team. But there is no way you could say a CB can impact his team as much as a QB. Add the fact that in most cases Revis' impact is passive (he can't score, he can only prevent others), also makes it impossible for him to be paid in the same way as a QB.

      The only argument for him is that he is so much better than the next CB. But that is no longer true. There are other cover corners out there.
    1. wxwax's Avatar
      Mr. Woody Johnson ought to slip on the cone of silence. He isn't helping anyone by talking like this.

      With so many holes on their roster, it makes sense for the Jets to explore their options. That knee is a big deal, though. He's not likely to be 100% at the start of the season. That hurts his value. I wonder how many 27 year olds make a full recovery from an ACL?
    1. KabaModernFan's Avatar
      Quote Originally Posted by ScottDCP View Post
      Using Aaron Williams and Justin Rogers of 2012 projected over a full season each, the worst CB in the league will give up 12-16 touchdowns directly, and (I am guessing here) another half dozen by failure to make a drive-stopping play on third and long. Using that number (that I just made up while changing a diaper) the best CB has less impact re: the average (terminology iwatt?) than does the best QB, as the average CB gives up more than zero TDs per year.

      Worth the noise because of skill (only reporters and fans get truly bothered by contract squabbles so long as dude performs when he shows up) but not worth quite the money he seeks.
      Just for frame of reference's sake:

      According to Pro Football Focus, the cornerback who gave up the most touchdown receptions as the primary man in coverage this past season was Patrick Robinson, with 9 TDs allowed. Richard Sherman gave up 2 TDs this past year, Charles Tillman gave up 3, and Antonio Cromartie gave up 5 TDs. Since 2009, Darrelle Revis has given up a total of 6 TDs in a little over three full seasons of play.

      But of course, you don't need those numbers in order to know that Revis is a damn good football player.
    1. ScottDCP's Avatar
      Quote Originally Posted by KabaModernFan View Post
      Ju;st for frame of reference's sake:

      According to Pro Football Focus, the cornerback who gave up the most touchdown receptions as the primary man in coverage this past season was Patrick Robinson, with 9 TDs allowed. Richard Sherman gave up 2 TDs this past year, Charles Tillman gave up 3, and Antonio Cromartie gave up 5 TDs. Since 2009, Darrelle Revis has given up a total of 6 TDs in a little over three full seasons of play.

      But of course, you don't need those numbers in order to know that Revis is a damn good football player.
      Williams gave up his 7 or so in half a year. Sad.
    1. xmenehune's Avatar
      What if you subtracted interceptions returned for a TD?
      Didn't Tillman have more than a few this year? This could make his total 0, right?

      Revis when healthy is among the best at his position and as we all know must affect game planning by the opposing OC, limiting his options on where and when to attack. Yes this is passive and very difficult to measure as far as stats go, but I would query the opposing coaches in the division and the conference as to what would they give up to have him on their team?
      A player?
      More than one player?
      A player and draft pick?
      A player and two draft picks?
      A player and three draft picks?
      Several draft picks?

      Would they replace their CB with Revis?

      NE BUF MIA (I'd think yes)
      BAL PIT CIN CLE (again yes)
      HOU, IND, TEN, JAC (yes)
      DEN, SD, OAK, KC (yes)

      NFC (someone else can guess)
    1. KabaModernFan's Avatar
      xmenehune, I am assuming when you ask which teams would replace their CB with Revis, you are asking if each team would rather have Revis than their current #1 CB. If that is the case, I can say with a very high degree of certainty that Baltimore would not answer the phone when the Jets start calling.

      And likely neither would Cleveland, Cincinnati, Houston, Tennessee, Denver, or Kansas City in the AFC. Not with what they would likely be required to give up in order to acquire him. I would also eliminate Pittsburgh from that discussion, since moves like acquiring Revis are not typically how they go about their business. I also find it hard to believe the Jets would trade Revis to another team within the AFC East, unless they know something about his knee that leads them to believe they wouldn't have to worry about it. All of those things considered, the number of potential suitors in the AFC dwindles considerably.
    1. tubbs1518's Avatar
      Quote Originally Posted by KabaModernFan View Post
      xmenehune, I am assuming when you ask which teams would replace their CB with Revis, you are asking if each team would rather have Revis than their current #1 CB. If that is the case, I can say with a very high degree of certainty that Baltimore would not answer the phone when the Jets start calling.

      And likely neither would Cleveland, Cincinnati, Houston, Tennessee, Denver, or Kansas City in the AFC. Not with what they would likely be required to give up in order to acquire him. I would also eliminate Pittsburgh from that discussion, since moves like acquiring Revis are not typically how they go about their business. I also find it hard to believe the Jets would trade Revis to another team within the AFC East, unless they know something about his knee that leads them to believe they wouldn't have to worry about it. All of those things considered, the number of potential suitors in the AFC dwindles considerably.
      I can guarantee you with the money and draft picks he would cost, if someone from the Jets called Brown he would hang up in a millisecond. No chance Cincy trades for him, and they shouldn't.
    1. xmenehune's Avatar
      c'mon BAL w/o Ladarius Webb is not the same and since he's coming off an injury it's always a wait and see. Though I'll admit that the BAL front office w/Ozzie and Company are particular about what they want. In NYJ I think the media has nothing better to do than to make mountains out of mole hills and Revis has been caught in their web. He'd be better off with a SB caliber team that is aging and he would probably get in line with the rest of the team. It's team in BAL, I can't say that with NYJ
      Revis seems like a frustrated player at times, he has the talent, he just knows his team is going nowhere for several years. We've seen this over the years in the NFL (usually younger players) it's just now the media has a bigger audience. So players are really being picked on IMO.

      PIT could use him, their CBs aren't that good and Polamalu has seen his best years gone by, Clark is stable, but not enough. Yeah I know PIT doesn't normally trade and those that they grow and don't fit in are shown the door even if they are pretty good players, so NO

      CLE has a new coach, they'll entertain thoughts if they can shut down half the field for most of the game.

      CIN w/Lewis and Co have taken chances on a lot of players with worst playing ability and 'activities'.

      HOU they could use another Jonathan Joseph, but yeah maybe they wouldn't trade, fairly conservative team with personnel.

      TEN has a history of having players that like to talk as well, they'll take a chance again

      DEN normally I say they wouldn't as well, but Bailey looks like he should retire and if Manning stayed, Revis might think he'd have a chance for a ring w/Manning still there.

      KC, new coaching staff and GM, Andy Reid has been known to take chances, I wonder if the GM would? KC D is already pretty good, their O is pretty bad, so I guess they wouldn't look to shore up D first. But I believe if you do something well, you need to keep doing it well with better players (if they are available) and Revis is in that category of special players (at least I think so) [or you'll regress]

      The NFC I just don't think would be as open to Revis,
      maybe JJ,
      unknown with Kelly @PHI
      NYG - I wonder if they would, I don't think Jets would let it occur, it would be such egg on their face if NYG went to the SB next year w/Revis
      Shanny, I don't think so

      CHI don't need him two very good CBs
      GB might (small maybe), but Revis wouldn't
      MIN how long will Winfield last is the question?, they should adopt read/option IMO
      DET odd I don't think they would even though they seem to a bit disorganized and reckless

      Schiano NO he let go Talib, can't see it,
      Smith NO conservative and their CBs do well in their scheme,
      CAR maybe? just how desperate is Rivera? This upcoming year will most likely be his last, unless they do the cure all
      NO they seem to need a safety more than a corner, but with a great corner, safety wouldn't have to do as much or play more run support which they seem to like, so I'll say no for now

      SEA NO don't need him
      SF could use him, but salary cap issues and giving up picks, not GM's style
      ARI new coaching staff, I wonder if Bowles would have any input? Unknown to me, still if I had to guess I would say yes
      STL Fisher maybe yes, maybe no, he brought along his CB from TEN and their was immediate improvement, another CB? could cost too much. STL and their draft will really tell the tale
    1. tubbs1518's Avatar
      STL just drafted Jenkins in the 2nd last year. He had 3 returns for TD's. I don't see them replacing him so fast. Jets are wanting at least a 1st rounder and Revis is wanting Franchise QB money. He isn't going to be easy to trade at all.
    1. xmenehune's Avatar
      Here's what I see, Revis is the best player on his team. His present team in disarray, they need more draft picks, what better way than to shop their best player.

      From the media (or is this from other teams) we see/read a bunch of negative stories. This should lessen his value, he has a knee issue, another thing to lessen his value, contract seems to be inflated (subtract more).

      So from my pov it seems like media is playing the great player gone bad angle, but he's just not that bad, but he was that great.

      If Wannstedt remains in NFL, he'll most likely vouch for Revis, and whatever teams gets him will likely get him as a bargain for a year. Else he's damaged goods and nobody will touch him and Jets will likely cut him.

      In recent years, media dogged Moss, but NE took him and he did extremely well that year w/a strong/smart QB. Moss was one of the few WR's that made QB's look good.
      Normally the opposite is true QB's make the WR, but their are exceptions to every rule and Moss was one of them.

      I say Revis is an exception to the rule, he can make DCs look really good. And when you have an exception you should pay the price. Of course, if you don't view him as an exception (or anyone), you'll never pay the 'price'.

      it's the knee issue that bothers me, he'd need to do several workouts with a fast WR to prove himself again (if I was evaluating trade bait), if not, NYJ is stuck with him, 'til he heals or they cut him
    1. xmenehune's Avatar
      Quote Originally Posted by tubbs1518 View Post
      STL just drafted Jenkins in the 2nd last year. He had 3 returns for TD's. I don't see them replacing him so fast. Jets are wanting at least a 1st rounder and Revis is wanting Franchise QB money. He isn't going to be easy to trade at all.
      I see your pov, it's just every team needs a nickel and w/o that nickel, they are vulnerable. Jenkins has great talent and Fisher as always takes talent in and gets the "buy in" from his players. STL is the weakest of the 3 defenses in the NFC West (IMO), what quicker way to upgrade, than to let Revis in for a year or two, while Jenkins figures out the nuances. I watched him get burned several times this year, he needs seasoning
    1. wxwax's Avatar
      Philosophically, I think Atlanta would take him. Asante Samuel isn't a shrinking violet and he's been a good fit. Nobody ever said Revis didn't play hard, which is what the Falcons really care about.

      Moneywise, they're committed to Samuel at one corner. Brent Grimes sat out almost the entire season with an Achilles. He's their nominal starter on the other side. He's not old and he made the 2010 Pro Bowl. But he was a franchise tag last season and he's out of contract, I believe. Injuries the last two seasons.

      We've discussed Atlanta's lack of stud defenders. Revis would change that, assuming he's healthy.

      I can't think of a reason why Washington wouldn't want Revis. Their secondary sucks. DeAngelo Hall is not a great player.

      The issue for both teams is what they'd be willing to give up for Revis, and whether the deal makes sense. Also, of course, his health.
    1. FrzzerBwler's Avatar
      Quote Originally Posted by iwatt View Post
      Imagine the circus if they let revis go....
      Wait a second, you mean the Jets could be an even bigger circus than they are now?
    1. mikesteelnation1's Avatar
      @xmenehune - did you actually say Pittsburgh's corners aren't that good? So the team that's led the league in total defense and passing defense for 2 years straight with a garbage pass rush and no turnovers aren't good??

      So somehow the 2 things that make a secondary look good (pressure and the turnovers they create) were missing, yet they were still #1. So how did they pull that off then, exactly? Unless they had good corners.

      Perhaps you saw too much of our practice squad guys late this year, when we were ravaged with injuries to our top 3 guys.

      A defense cannot be #1 vs the pass with no pass rush, unless it has good corners. Add to that polamalu was hurt almost all year, so please tell me how we have bad corners...

      Since 2005, our #1 corner Ike Taylor has played 65 games vs pro bowl receivers. BTW he plays man up on them, on an island. In those games he has allowed an average of 2.2 catches for 31.2 yards. Only a td once every 6 games vs EVERY pro bowl wr he's faced. Unfortunately, he hasn't made any pro bowls. He sure as hell should have, as our #2 Keenan lewis should have this year. They haven't simply because of how they've been taught to play. In Pittsburgh, we play the man, not the ball. Add to that both have hands of stone..

      Both are among the best pass defenders, but get left out because of how they've been taught technique. A technique I'm proud to say has led to them leading the league in pass defense two years running. Both are also quite adept in run support too, and awesome open field tacklers. Skills many don't see unless they watch the game tape.

      Corner is probably the most talented, and deepest position group on our team.

      Saying our corners aren't good seems ridiculous given those facts, doesn't it?

      To end this, we won't be in the revis Derby. We won't trade picks for a guy under contract for one year,.who's been s locker room problem. We've had enough of those lately, and are much more likely to give lewis money to resign. We don't deal in big names, ever. Certainly not here. Silly to even think it. I'd much rather the front office give lewis the $$$, instead of throwing away draft picks and giving much more $$. Lewis is our future, not a media whore with a bum knee..
    1. xmenehune's Avatar
      Quote Originally Posted by mikesteelnation1 View Post
      @xmenehune - did you actually say Pittsburgh's corners aren't that good? So the team that's led the league in total defense and passing defense for 2 years straight with a garbage pass rush and no turnovers aren't good??

      So somehow the 2 things that make a secondary look good (pressure and the turnovers they create) were missing, yet they were still #1. So how did they pull that off then, exactly? Unless they had good corners.

      Perhaps you saw too much of our practice squad guys late this year, when we were ravaged with injuries to our top 3 guys.

      A defense cannot be #1 vs the pass with no pass rush, unless it has good corners. Add to that polamalu was hurt almost all year, so please tell me how we have bad corners...

      Since 2005, our #1 corner Ike Taylor has played 65 games vs pro bowl receivers. BTW he plays man up on them, on an island. In those games he has allowed an average of 2.2 catches for 31.2 yards. Only a td once every 6 games vs EVERY pro bowl wr he's faced. Unfortunately, he hasn't made any pro bowls. He sure as hell should have, as our #2 Keenan lewis should have this year. They haven't simply because of how they've been taught to play. In Pittsburgh, we play the man, not the ball. Add to that both have hands of stone..

      Both are among the best pass defenders, but get left out because of how they've been taught technique. A technique I'm proud to say has led to them leading the league in pass defense two years running. Both are also quite adept in run support too, and awesome open field tacklers. Skills many don't see unless they watch the game tape.

      Corner is probably the most talented, and deepest position group on our team.

      Saying our corners aren't good seems ridiculous given those facts, doesn't it?

      To end this, we won't be in the revis Derby. We won't trade picks for a guy under contract for one year,.who's been s locker room problem. We've had enough of those lately, and are much more likely to give lewis money to resign. We don't deal in big names, ever. Certainly not here. Silly to even think it. I'd much rather the front office give lewis the $$$, instead of throwing away draft picks and giving much more $$. Lewis is our future, not a media whore with a bum knee..
      IMHO PIT has been on the decline for these past two seasons and your division rival has been trending upward despite having an aged D. Your pass rush just hasn't been what it was (w/o Harrison being his dominating self and the rotation of inj'd NT are noticeable) and the CBs would have an immediate boost if Revis were to come in. I would pick on Ike Taylor. Lewis the only DB that played all year. You can use stats anyway you want to, but if you don't win the division or make it into the playoffs, something needs to change.
      On some teams it's obivious (example KC Offense - just miserable) others not so obvious. PIT has had a winning formula for years that have always kept them in the respectable category, they run the ball and play solid D.
      AFC North is a division that has always had it tough, there's been years with CLE and or CIN, being fairly weak on O or D, but PIT and BAL have just kept it up year after year.
      This year I just don't believe the stats are truly indicative of PIT D, your opponent W-L record was weaker than BAL and yet BAL won the division. PIT D did fairly well despite all the injuries that occurred, but I think it's more due to DC LeBeau than having good CBs.
      NYG curiously enough had also DL issues this year and IMO is very similar to PIT and they could use a CB of Revis caliber as well. PIT CBs are good at best, over the years it's enough to stay in the NFL, but they'll be replaced. Rarely do you see CBs stay for a long time at their position.
      W's and L's are what count, which goes along with points allowed and points scored, I place more emphasis on those than total D stats. I think LeBeau runs the 3-4 better than anyone else, Polamalu movement prior to snap can keep an O guessing, but their is one team that knows how to beat PIT via the air and it's NE. Brady and Co do mix it up a bit, but primarily they'll pick on whoever is in the slot and on the outside CB that they deem weaker for that game.
      I also don't think PIT drafts for CBs as well they draft for DL and LBs, they are the weakest at drafting CBs, not since Woodson, have I seen the range and closing speed, that I would deem a CB good. I'd call PIT CBs very serviceable at the moment, but not quite up to the good to great range.
      I just have a different view of CBs, regardless of technique being taught. You can't teach speed and area quickness. And flexibility is slowly lost over time. I'd prefer bait the QB and cut off the pass.

      Maybe it's more part of OC Haley fault this past season, but I think LeBeau holds more influence with his guys in the front office then Haley does. So he keeps his players, even those injured.
      I don't have a favorite team, I get to watch a few teams live on regular broadcast each week, the rest I watch via NFL rewind. PIT as a whole team is good, I just don't think the CBs are that good to great that I'd like to see, they're serviceable. Good CBs are hard to find, very few teams have one. Revis is the exception to the rule, unless he doesn't recover from his injury, I'll continue to believe so.
    1. Trumpetbdw's Avatar
      Quote Originally Posted by xmenehune View Post
      IMHO PIT has been on the decline for these past two seasons and your division rival has been trending upward despite having an aged D. Your pass rush just hasn't been what it was (w/o Harrison being his dominating self and the rotation of inj'd NT are noticeable) and the CBs would have an immediate boost if Revis were to come in. I would pick on Ike Taylor. Lewis the only DB that played all year. You can use stats anyway you want to, but if you don't win the division or make it into the playoffs, something needs to change.
      On some teams it's obivious (example KC Offense - just miserable) others not so obvious. PIT has had a winning formula for years that have always kept them in the respectable category, they run the ball and play solid D.
      AFC North is a division that has always had it tough, there's been years with CLE and or CIN, being fairly weak on O or D, but PIT and BAL have just kept it up year after year.
      This year I just don't believe the stats are truly indicative of PIT D, your opponent W-L record was weaker than BAL and yet BAL won the division. PIT D did fairly well despite all the injuries that occurred, but I think it's more due to DC LeBeau than having good CBs.
      NYG curiously enough had also DL issues this year and IMO is very similar to PIT and they could use a CB of Revis caliber as well. PIT CBs are good at best, over the years it's enough to stay in the NFL, but they'll be replaced. Rarely do you see CBs stay for a long time at their position.
      W's and L's are what count, which goes along with points allowed and points scored, I place more emphasis on those than total D stats. I think LeBeau runs the 3-4 better than anyone else, Polamalu movement prior to snap can keep an O guessing, but their is one team that knows how to beat PIT via the air and it's NE. Brady and Co do mix it up a bit, but primarily they'll pick on whoever is in the slot and on the outside CB that they deem weaker for that game.
      I also don't think PIT drafts for CBs as well they draft for DL and LBs, they are the weakest at drafting CBs, not since Woodson, have I seen the range and closing speed, that I would deem a CB good. I'd call PIT CBs very serviceable at the moment, but not quite up to the good to great range.
      I just have a different view of CBs, regardless of technique being taught. You can't teach speed and area quickness. And flexibility is slowly lost over time. I'd prefer bait the QB and cut off the pass.

      Maybe it's more part of OC Haley fault this past season, but I think LeBeau holds more influence with his guys in the front office then Haley does. So he keeps his players, even those injured.
      I don't have a favorite team, I get to watch a few teams live on regular broadcast each week, the rest I watch via NFL rewind. PIT has a whole team is good, I just don't think the CBs are that good to great that I'd like to see, they're serviceable. Good CBs are hard to find, very few teams have one. Revis is the exception to the rule, unless he doesn't recover from his injury, I'll continue to believe so.
      In a fantasy draft, of course any team would take on Revis. He'd make every secondary in the league better. That much is unquestioned. But add in the baggage, by way of the injury, the contract, and the yearly dissatisfaction over said contract, and there is no way that adding him would make Pittsburgh better, considering the roster reshuffling that would have to take place to put him on their roster.

      Pittsburgh has a number of problems. Their best players on the DL are aging, while the highly drafted young guys aren't doing enough to step up. The one player who looks like he could be a dominant force, DT Steve McLendon, can't get on the field because of Dick LeBeau preferring to play the more experienced, and at this point, not nearly as good Casey Hampton. At LB, Lawrence Timmons is nearly the equal of Patrick Willis, but with all of the injuries on the outside to Woodley and Harrison, they can't get a consistent pass rush. Clark has played great, and while Polamalu finally performed as his old self at the tail end of the season, his diminished play even prior to his injury killed them for most of the year, until they finally figured out how to effectively scheme without him.

      The offense was starting to gel when Roethlisberger went down, and when he came back, he, nor the offense, was the same again. The receivers dropped way too many passes, and they could not find a consistent running game. Their OL is always injured, and performed inconsistently for the (seemingly) 137th season in a row.

      Through it all, the Steelers had 2 consistent strengths this season. Heath Miller was one. For my money, he was the best TE in the league this year. The other strength was their CBs. Ike Taylor is not quite Darrell Revis, but he is one of the top cover CBs in the league, as mike mentioned earlier. Keenan Lewis has developed into a future pro bowler on the other side as well. Plus, their 3rd CB, Cortez Allen, grew immensely over the course of the season, and at the end of the year, was their best playmaker. He and Lewis are both highly regarded young CBs. And when Taylor and Allen both got hurt, it allowed Curtis Brown and Josh Victorian to gain some valuable experience. Victorian and Brown both struggled mightily when forced to play as the top 2 guys against SD, as would be expected, but closed out the year very strongly, and are more than acceptable as depth.

      Would Revis improve their secondary? Absolutely. But there are much greater needs in Pittsburgh than a top CB, especially considering that not only are CBs a team strength, but it's also one of the few places on the defensive side of the ball where, other than Ike Taylor, they're young.
    1. Pruitt's Avatar
      Quote Originally Posted by ScottDCP View Post
      Williams gave up his 7 or so in half a year. Sad.
      And he was chosen a couple of spots ahead of Kaepernick.

      (For those who don't care about the Bills, this is our new favorite game: "Who could we have had instead...")

      A CB coming of a huge knee injury is really not worth the effort if he demands top dollar. Harsh, but true.
    1. Nancy's Avatar
      CAR maybe? just how desperate is Rivera? This upcoming year will most likely be his last, unless they do the cure all
      Revis is pretty clearly better than anyone the Panthers have; Gamble is a good player but he's pushing 30 and is one of the many Panther defenders who is constantly injured. Josh Norman had problems as a rookie, but he's still an unknown quantity. Captain Munnerlyn is...well, he's got a really cool name and he's not completely without value. So not taking the attitude into account, Revis would be a big improvement.

      Problem is, the Panthers can't afford him. I don't spend much (any) time worrying about cap issues, but I know the Panthers are about $16 million over. I don't really expect them to keep Beason or Gamble, and DeAngelo Willams played the last several games like a man looking for a job, but Revis may still be too much trouble and too much money.
    1. mikesteelnation1's Avatar
      Quote Originally Posted by xmenehune View Post
      IMHO PIT has been on the decline for these past two seasons and your division rival has been trending upward despite having an aged D. Your pass rush just hasn't been what it was (w/o Harrison being his dominating self and the rotation of inj'd NT are noticeable) and the CBs would have an immediate boost if Revis were to come in. I would pick on Ike Taylor. Lewis the only DB that played all year. You can use stats anyway you want to, but if you don't win the division or make it into the playoffs, something needs to change.
      On some teams it's obivious (example KC Offense - just miserable) others not so obvious. PIT has had a winning formula for years that have always kept them in the respectable category, they run the ball and play solid D.
      AFC North is a division that has always had it tough, there's been years with CLE and or CIN, being fairly weak on O or D, but PIT and BAL have just kept it up year after year.
      This year I just don't believe the stats are truly indicative of PIT D, your opponent W-L record was weaker than BAL and yet BAL won the division. PIT D did fairly well despite all the injuries that occurred, but I think it's more due to DC LeBeau than having good CBs.
      NYG curiously enough had also DL issues this year and IMO is very similar to PIT and they could use a CB of Revis caliber as well. PIT CBs are good at best, over the years it's enough to stay in the NFL, but they'll be replaced. Rarely do you see CBs stay for a long time at their position.
      W's and L's are what count, which goes along with points allowed and points scored, I place more emphasis on those than total D stats. I think LeBeau runs the 3-4 better than anyone else, Polamalu movement prior to snap can keep an O guessing, but their is one team that knows how to beat PIT via the air and it's NE. Brady and Co do mix it up a bit, but primarily they'll pick on whoever is in the slot and on the outside CB that they deem weaker for that game.
      I also don't think PIT drafts for CBs as well they draft for DL and LBs, they are the weakest at drafting CBs, not since Woodson, have I seen the range and closing speed, that I would deem a CB good. I'd call PIT CBs very serviceable at the moment, but not quite up to the good to great range.
      I just have a different view of CBs, regardless of technique being taught. You can't teach speed and area quickness. And flexibility is slowly lost over time. I'd prefer bait the QB and cut off the pass.

      Maybe it's more part of OC Haley fault this past season, but I think LeBeau holds more influence with his guys in the front office then Haley does. So he keeps his players, even those injured.
      I don't have a favorite team, I get to watch a few teams live on regular broadcast each week, the rest I watch via NFL rewind. PIT as a whole team is good, I just don't think the CBs are that good to great that I'd like to see, they're serviceable. Good CBs are hard to find, very few teams have one. Revis is the exception to the rule, unless he doesn't recover from his injury, I'll continue to believe so.
      It's quite difficult for me to buy anything you're trying to sell in this entire post, and you didn't answer a single point of contention I had in the post you're answering. You deflected. That doesn't work with me, perhaps you haven't read enough of my posts to know that.

      You stated you don't have a favorite team, sometimes catch games on replay, don't care about stats, and restated things I've already capitulated to.

      How can you possibly have an opinion that holds any weight when you haven't seen the games and disregard the stats?? Am I being punk'd??

      Please tell me how our defense, which you feel has gone downhill, and can't pressure the qb has been #1 overall and vs the pass the last 2 years. It hasn't been polamalu, he only played 2 games like himself this year, and we were #1 before he did.. how did.we do that with mediocre corners?

      Perhaps you can't teach speed and area quickness, but you sure as hell can teach how to keep the wr from catching the ball. I'd much rather 2 corners playing the man and breaking up passes, all the while allowing little 20+ yard passes, than guys jumping routes to catch picks, but getting toasted at least as many times during their gambles..

      You are free to prefer what you like, but don't you dare try to say our corners are anything but good to great when you haven't watched the games, you ignore the stats, and you prefer a "specific" type of corner. This isn't Madden. The teams performed as they did. It's all on paper and tape.

      A defense isn't #1 overall and vs the pass 2 years running with bad corners, when the pass rush isn't what it should be. Please tell me how the #1 pass defense has bad corners, not your spin on what you like in corners, you're not an NFL talent scout. And not much of an NFL fan, from what you posted.

      You ignore stats, and don't watch games. How can you possibly have a credible opinion then???