Will Big Ben's 'injuries' end up hurting him?

[Curtis]

It's no secret that Ben is always hurt. He plays through injuries that would bench mortal man. He's the ultimate competitor, tough guy, cyborg....yeah we have heard this endlessly. So are the injuries real or are they made up? Here are some thoughts to get the discussion going.

Why would Ben want to put every ache and pain out there to the public, the other teams and the Steelers? I mean think about it. He is more willing to volunteer specifics about his injuries than any player I have ever seen.

Is he a drama queen that embellishes injuries publicly so he can be a hero on the field?
Why specifically point out every flaw you have to your upcoming opponent? Fake injury, fight through fake pain, win game and be a hero.

Ben's game has always been running around, extending plays and taking risks. But as a result, he has gotten many, many injuries. Embellished or not, the Steelers ownership has made changes to the staff and the offense to protect their "injury prone" QB. Ben was openly pissed about that. And even took shots at Haley about the dink and dunk.

At what point do the Steelers front office decide that Ben is an injury liability?

[mikesteelnation1]

I'm sorry, but most of the issues with Ben's injuries and him talking about them have stemmed from the post mortem discussions Ben has had. When he told folks about injuries that had not been on the injury report. Has he run his mouth too much in that regard? Yup. Chastising him for attending speaking about a clear injury during a presser set up by the front office? Not so much.

The Steelers are one of, if not the largest brand in football. Our elite starting qb got injured, left the game, and was taken to the hospital for tests. The results of which, the customer (us fans) want to know. Why shouldn't he share that? It doesn't give the opposition any advantage. He's hurt, and its his throwing shoulder. Everyone in the tv viewing audience knew that. Of course the other team does. No different than his prior ankle , first shoulder injury, or foot injuries give any tactical advantage. Him talking about prior injuries no one knew about was him stroking his own feathers. So he's not the nicest person. So what? We've all discussed both the injuries and Ben's personality prior, and we've all agreed he's been a douche prior, and needs to not bring up the phantom injuries that were never reported.

Ben never took shots at Haley. He called the offense for what it is. That quick hit stuff had Ben on pace for his career low in sacks/attempt. The brass did call for Ben getting hit less, and he has. He got a freak injury on a regular drop, not one where he was freelancing and holding the ball too long. The line broke down and Ben got crushed doing exactly what the brass wanted. Was Ben pissed when they capped his golf buddy and off-season neighbor? Absolutely. Was it the right call in hindsight? Absolutely. Before the injury Ben was playing the best season of ball in his NFL career.

Calling a guy who's missed 13 games to injury in 9 professional seasons, behind that line, is laughable. Saying the Rooney's would even think of cutting ties is preposterous. You don't cut one of the 4 elite qbs in the league because he got hurt.

It's clear, you don't like Ben or the Steelers. That's fine. Not sure how this thread adds much value. If he's a drama queen that embellishes, it's certainly a character flaw, but if it emboldens him to deliver like he has, so be it. He certainly isn't now. If he's injury prone in youreyes so be it I'll take a near 70% win %, getting to a sb 38% of his years, and winning 67% of those. Add to that 50% of his seasons end with an AFC champ game, winning 75% of those.

I'm just sayin...

[packa7x]

He reminds me a lot of Brett Favre. I remember back in 2002 Lavar Arrington got Favre and twisted his knee up. He laid on the field rolling in pain and was carted off. All week was "wahhhh wahhhh wahhh it hurts it hurts!!!!!". They had a bye so he rested it up...it was a sprained ACL. He comes back vs Miami after the bye and the FIRST PLAY he runs a bootleg. Or a good example of Ben is n XLV. He gets crushed on a play and gets up limping. He stays in the game and he RUNS with the ball the very next play and is suddenly the fastest guy on the field. I don't think it's intentional with either guy though. It may just be a coping mechanism.

[ScottDCP]

I think he is mostly proud of doing it and likes to brag a bit afterward. The thing you have indirectly pointed out is that he doesn't think ahead very much. I have always thought he was a dumbass while swearing at him for breaking tackles and being accurate when he has had no right to be.

[Curtis]

Calling a guy who's missed 13 games to injury in 9 professional seasons, behind that line, is laughable. Saying the Rooney's would even think of cutting ties is preposterous. You don't cut one of the 4 elite qbs in the league because he got hurt.

It's clear, you don't like Ben or the Steelers. That's fine. Not sure how this thread adds much value. If he's a drama queen that embellishes, it's certainly a character flaw, but if it emboldens him to deliver like he has, so be it. He certainly isn't now. If he's injury prone in youreyes so be it I'll take a near 70% win %, getting to a sb 38% of his years, and winning 67% of those. Add to that 50% of his seasons end with an AFC champ game, winning 75% of those.

I'm just sayin...

First, I never said they would or should cut Ben. I simply asked at what point do the Rooney's decide enough is enough. Second, if you don't think the Rooney's would never cut the 2 ring top 4 elite Ben, then your thinking could be called preposterous. They were prepared to release him after the second sexual assault charges came up. He is only still on the team under the condition that he keeps his nose clean. One hair out of line and he's gone.

At what point do they look to draft his replacement? They've drafted 2 QB's in 9 years, the most recent was Dixon in 08. Come April it will be 5 years since they drafted a QB. When all they have behind Ben is Leftwich and Batch I think the time is now to look for the future. This is the reason Tomlin wanted to sign Vick when the Falcons released him in 09, but the assault charges hit Ben at that time and the Rooney's nixed signing Vick because it would add to the negative PR.

You say Ben is injury prone in my eyes? I would say he is injury prone to many eyes. As a matter of fact, I've heard that term about Ben and other QB;s like Vick and Stafford for a few years now. It's not like I just pulled it out of my butt. Look at the list of injuries. It's like an illustrated orthopedic diagram. Mike Vick has been called injury prone, and everyone points out that he has only played a full 16 game season once in his career. Guess what? Ben has only played a full 16 games season once in his career.

This thread is meant as an objective discussion about how the injuries can be perceived by media, fans and the ultimately the team. Don't try to spin this by making my intentions of this thread seem to be subjective. I don't like Ben and I'm not a fan of the Steelers but my ties to that city are deep and I have discussions with those Steelers fans every single day. I have a finger on the pulse of the fans there and I hear the good and bad and the ugly. Not every Steelers fan likes Ben, not every fan likes Tomlin. Everything I've said here is no different than what they are talking about there.

If you don't think this thread adds value, that's fine, don't post in it and find one you deem worthy.

[vancemeek]

Mike, you said there needed to be more conversational posts and arguing is good. You can claim it has no value just because it negatively talks about the Steelers.

[packa7x]

I think Ben is absolutely injury prone. They call Aaron Rodgers injury prone because he had 2 concussions and broke his leg in 2006. Injury prone doesn't necessarily mean that he's going to miss time, but it does mean that his style of play is correlated to a high injury rate. Listening to sports doctors talk about whether a player is more "injury prone" than others, the conclusion reached is that unless it's something like an ACL that has a greater chance of reinjury after the First injury, nobody is really injury prone, it's more what they do on the field. Ben runs around like a mad man but tries to complete passes instead of running. The guy just gets caught in awkward positions a lot.

[mikesteelnation1]

Mike, you said there needed to be more conversational posts and arguing is good. You can claim it has no value just because it negatively talks about the Steelers.

Vance I did say there needed to be more conversational posts and that arguing was ok, as long as it wasn't disrespectful. I wasn't, nor was Curtis. I also in that same rant said the morality police need to let things lie, and leave people be when they were debating as long as it was respectful. Perhaps you didn't read all of what I said. Like it seems you didn't here.

I said I didn't see how the thread added value, not that it doesn't. That was a direct reply to Curtis, not anyone else. Not sure why you felt the need to interject, with no skin in the game and no posted opinion on the matter. Curtis certainly didn't need any help in defending his thoughts, he does just.fine on his own.

No one cursed, no one insulted the other. Just 2 adults having a respectful discussion from differing points of view. Not to be suppositional on Curtis' part, but I think he will agree, we don't need the morality police to referee our discussions. We can handle that on our own.

I'll also point out that my question as to the value it added had nothing to do with being negative about the Steelers. If you read my post it spoke of the things Curtis mentioned that we have all discussed and mostly agreed about here before. In his reply to me he clarified his POV, and I'll reply to that post to address it specifically with him.

Feel free to share your opinion in the matter, but no need for a mother hen. That kills conversations. It sure did here. I don't count packa, no one {ever seems to shut him up}

[vancemeek]

I read your post.

[mikesteelnation1]

First, I never said they would or should cut Ben. I simply asked at what point do the Rooney's decide enough is enough. Second, if you don't think the Rooney's would never cut the 2 ring top 4 elite Ben, then your thinking could be called preposterous. They were prepared to release him after the second sexual assault charges came up. He is only still on the team under the condition that he keeps his nose clean. One hair out of line and he's gone.

At what point do they look to draft his replacement? They've drafted 2 QB's in 9 years, the most recent was Dixon in 08. Come April it will be 5 years since they drafted a QB. When all they have behind Ben is Leftwich and Batch I think the time is now to look for the future. This is the reason Tomlin wanted to sign Vick when the Falcons released him in 09, but the assault charges hit Ben at that time and the Rooney's nixed signing Vick because it would add to the negative PR.

You say Ben is injury prone in my eyes? I would say he is injury prone to many eyes. As a matter of fact, I've heard that term about Ben and other QB;s like Vick and Stafford for a few years now. It's not like I just pulled it out of my butt. Look at the list of injuries. It's like an illustrated orthopedic diagram. Mike Vick has been called injury prone, and everyone points out that he has only played a full 16 game season once in his career. Guess what? Ben has only played a full 16 games season once in his career.

This thread is meant as an objective discussion about how the injuries can be perceived by media, fans and the ultimately the team. Don't try to spin this by making my intentions of this thread seem to be subjective. I don't like Ben and I'm not a fan of the Steelers but my ties to that city are deep and I have discussions with those Steelers fans every single day. I have a finger on the pulse of the fans there and I hear the good and bad and the ugly. Not every Steelers fan likes Ben, not every fan likes Tomlin. Everything I've said here is no different than what they are talking about there.

If you don't think this thread adds value, that's fine, don't post in it and find one you deem worthy.

I said I didn't see how this thread added value, not that it didn't. As a group we've taken most of the discussed topics to task. The ones I addressed. We all mostly agree. Don't play up your injuries, and don't be a douche. Check and check. Now that you've clarified your point we can discuss it further. Forgive my supposition about your bias about the team or Ben. However you can't blame me for doing so, since you're quite vocal in those regards I took a stance based on that.. that said let's talk the other points...

There's no way any of us can say anything for sure about what transpired between Ben and the rooneys regarding the allegations. They weren't going to cut him, that much is clear. They did shop him for picks though, but the rams wouldn't jump high enough. The Rooneys may have high morals, but they also make exceptions for exceptional players. It's a business, you do what's best for it. As such, Ben is married.to the team through his contract. They couldn't afford to cut him even if they wanted to.

Saying he's injury prone and using captain Charmin in Detroit, and Vick as parallels isnt the best of comparisons. None of them are even close to comparable in style or success.

I get it your plugged in to Pittsburgh, as am I. I just disregard the doom and gloom and go on what I see. The Pittsburgh fan base is maniacal, as is the eagles. What the masses say and think, added to what the talking heads say and think, isn't always indicative of what the plugged in fans think.. it's all relative in the further explanations of what your op had suggested.

We can debate the particulars, and I'm glad to, but your op read like an ESPN article based on what we've said here prior. Glad we got it figured out sans the morality police and have come to the nuts and bolts of the discussion..