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Thread: Nick Saban

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    Nick Saban

    Fun rumours about him returning to Cleveland with Mike Lombardi in tow.

    One can dream, can't one?

    On a related note, I just watched Cleveland '95 on the NFL network. A very well done documentary, but boy, it made my blood boil.
    “I’ve always been a big fan of Norv Turner. I think he gets it. I think he does an outstanding job.” — Pat Shurmur

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    Not sure I'd want him. His stint in Miami was unconvincing.

    Alabama fans are probably having conniptions. For all the talk about 'Bama's great history and tradition, the truth is that one man is responsible for their recent run of success. Lose him and they're back to David Shula. And 'Bama fans know it, too. That's why they erected a nine-foot statue of Saban outside their stadium.

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    Quote Originally Posted by wxwax View Post
    Not sure I'd want him. His stint in Miami was unconvincing.

    Alabama fans are probably having conniptions. For all the talk about 'Bama's great history and tradition, the truth is that one man is responsible for their recent run of success. Lose him and they're back to David Shula. And 'Bama fans know it, too. That's why they erected a nine-foot statue of Saban outside their stadium.
    Yes and No about Alabama's success. Alabama is one of the marquee football programs in college football. So with the right coach, you can win national championships. But you can't just plug in any coach to win a national championship.

    As for his pro career, Saban didn't get much input in personnel decisions which is why he wants a guy that thinks like him as Lombardi. Just because a coach has a so so first professional job doesn't mean you shouldn't want him. Belichik was uninsipiring in Cleveland and he seems to be doing fine in New England.

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    I, for one, have no idea why Mike Lombardi is considered by so many people to be an upgrade over Tom Heckert.
    @kocsan

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by hobbes27 View Post
    Alabama is one of the marquee football programs in college football. So with the right coach, you can win national championships. But you can't just plug in any coach to win a national championship.
    You could say that for a lot of programs..

    I think Saban could succeed. He runs a pro-style offense and is one of the few college teams that uses a 34 D. They only averaged 3.8 penalties per game (which puts them at the top with the military academies), so he knows how to keep his team disciplined. He's pretty similar to Jim Harbaugh.
    If you ask me how I want to be remembered, it is as a winner. You know what a winner is? A winner is somebody who has given his best effort, who has tried the hardest they possibly can, who has utilized every ounce of energy and strength within them to accomplish something. It doesn't mean that they accomplished it or failed, it means that they've given it their best. That's a winner.”
    ― Walter Payton

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    Quote Originally Posted by hobbes27 View Post
    Yes and No about Alabama's success. Alabama is one of the marquee football programs in college football. So with the right coach, you can win national championships. But you can't just plug in any coach to win a national championship.

    As for his pro career, Saban didn't get much input in personnel decisions which is why he wants a guy that thinks like him as Lombardi. Just because a coach has a so so first professional job doesn't mean you shouldn't want him. Belichik was uninsipiring in Cleveland and he seems to be doing fine in New England.
    Belichik is remarkable for being the exception to the rule. I wouldn't use him a marker for anything other than exceptionalism. The guy is one-of-a-kind.

    I also wouldn't give Saban control over pro personnel. Very, very few coaches are any good at it. Most recently, it's been the undoing of Andy Reid, who is a first class coach.

    I agree, Alabama's status makes hiring top coaches easier. But hiring coaches is a very difficult thing to do. Very difficult. Here's a list of Alabama coaches after Bear Bryant and before Nick Saban. Stop me when we get to a great one.

    Ray Perkins
    Bill Curry
    Gene Stallings
    Mike DuBose
    Dennis Franchione
    Mike Price
    Mike Shula

    The best of them, Bill Curry, had a .722 winning percentage. They chased him out of town. No amount of tradition helps you make the right choice when hiring a coach. Seemingly, it's a matter of luck.

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    College coaching ISNT about player evaluation, its about recruiting. Most everyone agrees on who the top recruits are, plus or minus a few variations and surprises.

    If Alabama can get 2-4 of the (25) Rivals 5 star players and 11-13 of the Top100, then you don't have to worry about evaluation skills. Most of your opponents likely have no 5 stars and only a couple 4 stars. Go to a league where each team gets 1 of the top 32 and 3 of the top96 and no more, and where the order is reverse of last year's finish, THEN evaluation to find gems and avoid dogs is critical. Saban @ Alabama doesn't USE evaluation skills, so his success doesn't demonstrate them.

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    Quote Originally Posted by wxwax View Post
    His stint in Miami was unconvincing.
    I disagree. I thought it was VERY convincing. I think he is more Mangini than he is Belichick.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Docta View Post
    You could say that for a lot of programs..

    I think Saban could succeed. He runs a pro-style offense and is one of the few college teams that uses a 34 D. They only averaged 3.8 penalties per game (which puts them at the top with the military academies), so he knows how to keep his team disciplined. He's pretty similar to Jim Harbaugh.
    Uh no. Not all programs have the success of Alabama. Its a whole different story comparing Alabama to say Vanderbilt or Kentucky. Some schools are much easy for recruiting, such as Alabama which has a built-in reputation going in.

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    Quote Originally Posted by wxwax View Post
    Belichik is remarkable for being the exception to the rule. I wouldn't use him a marker for anything other than exceptionalism. The guy is one-of-a-kind.

    I also wouldn't give Saban control over pro personnel. Very, very few coaches are any good at it. Most recently, it's been the undoing of Andy Reid, who is a first class coach.

    I agree, Alabama's status makes hiring top coaches easier. But hiring coaches is a very difficult thing to do. Very difficult. Here's a list of Alabama coaches after Bear Bryant and before Nick Saban. Stop me when we get to a great one.

    Ray Perkins
    Bill Curry
    Gene Stallings
    Mike DuBose
    Dennis Franchione
    Mike Price
    Mike Shula

    The best of them, Bill Curry, had a .722 winning percentage. They chased him out of town. No amount of tradition helps you make the right choice when hiring a coach. Seemingly, it's a matter of luck.
    I wasn't saying that Saban should get control over personnnel, I was saying that when Saban coached at Miami, he didn't get the players that he wanted. The coach and GM need to be on the same page. My point is that you can't exactly disqualfiy Saban over what happened in the past. I'm not saying he can make it in the pros. I am actually skeptical that he can. But that doesn't mean he can't be.

    And you bring up a valid point about the right coach. But Nick Saban ain't winning national championships anywhere he goes. He's doing it in Alabama because he's good and he's got a built-in recruiting advantage to take advatange of.

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